When Microsoft announced a “Windows Package Manager” (better known as WinGet) in the context of the Build conference in 2020, hardly anyone suspected that this overdue, long-desired tool was not a “Microsoft original”.
A Canadian programmer, my today’s guest Keivan Beigi, had developed a package manager called “AppGet” a few years earlier and made it available under an open source license. When Microsoft employees contacted him one fine day, what belonged together seemed to come together. But then the story took its own course. When Microsoft finally published the first preview of WinGet six months later, it was all too obvious that they simply copied AppGet – without giving credit, which caused loud criticism.
I talk to Keivan about the background of his technology, package management in general and Microsoft’s fickle strategy towards its own community.
In the bonus section, you’ll find a reference, a little salute to the colleagues of Windows Weekly, Paul Thurrott and Mary Joe Foley, whom we both admire, and who played a significant role in making Keivan “famous” from one day to the next.
The interview was recorded on December 20, 2021 in Vancouver and Duisburg.
Show notes
- Keivan’s private homepage: keivan.io
- Keivan’s company: polyfill.cc
- Keivan on Twitter: twitter.com/kbeigi
- Demitrius Nelon on Microsoft DevBlogs: Windows Package Manager Preview (May 19th, 2020)
- Demitrius Nelon on Microsoft DevBlogs: Windows Package Manager 1.0
- Intel i386, Timeline of Computer History 1986
- Floppy disk (WP)
- Wolfenstein
- Prince of Persia
- Mac transition to Intel processors (WP)
- George Brown College of Applied Arts and Technology
- Visual Basic .NET (WP)
- DotNetNuke (DNN)
- Turing, programming language (WP)
- University of Toronto
- University of Manitoba
- Gnome vs KDE
German article from Heise online: Linux-Geschichte: KDE und Gnome wetteifern um den Linux-Desktop
English article from opensource.com: How the Linux desktop has grown - APT, Advanced packet tool (WP)
- Keivan Beigi: Why Chocolatey is Broken Beyond Any Hope READING TIP!
- Keivan Beigi: The Day AppGet Died READING TIP!
- AppGet source (Github)
- AppGet vs WinGet manifest files
- Microsoft docs: Create your package manifest
- Sonarr
- Apache License
- Janice Friedman: Understanding the Differences Between C#, C++, and C
- Microsoft’s belated credit to Keivan
- RuckZuck
- SwiftOnSecurity about WSUS (Twitter)
- Windows Weekly
- Paul Thurrott: AppGet Creator Says Microsoft Stole His Product
- Scott Hanselman: .NET 6 Hot Reload in Visual Studio 2022, VS Code, and NOTEPAD?!? (YouTube)
- The verge: Microsoft angers the .NET open source community with a controversial decision
- Mayank Sharma: Microsoft reinstates Hot Reload tool after huge open-source backlash
- Scott Hunter: .NET Hot Reload Support via CLI
- Guido van Rossum
- Miguel De Icaza
- HackerNews: Microsoft copied new Windows Package Manager from rival AppGet (June 1, 2020)
- “MS Steals WinGet” taken from “OK, Mr. Mxyzptlk”: WINDOWS WEEKLY Episode 675 (Jun 3rd 2020)
- Paul Thurrott: Ferrous and FeFe – Windows Weekly 676
Chapters
00:00:00.001 Intro: Bluenotes by Airtone
00:01:20.382 Welcome
00:02:18.802 Keivan’s beginnings
00:09:52.663 Stuck with Windows
00:14:59.809 The missing package management
00:28:39.052 Rocket science
00:31:14.582 From AppGet to WinGet
00:41:33.521 Conspirancy theories
00:45:10.348 WinGet vs AppGet
00:48:51.328 The vendor vs the community
00:51:47.876 WinGet++
00:58:57.169 Package formats
01:05:55.381 Predeictions
01:08:28.942 No regrets
01:12:18.061 Hot reload
01:16:13.781 Competing languages
01:22:30.785 Wrap-up
01:24:41.144 Bonus:Off the records
Music